One of the biggest questions we get is “How do you find good help? Everyone I hire seems to be unreliable.”
This is a valid point. Many subcontractors are not reliable. They either show up late (or not at all) and their work is shoddy.
If you’re trying to grow your painting business, bad subcontractors can really put a wrench in your operation. You have to show up to the job site to make sure everything’s ok, or go to the paint store to get something they forgot. THEN you have to deal with an angry customer who’s not satisfied with the work.
There ARE reliable subcontractors out there. It’s just a matter of FINDING them and KEEPING them.
Many painting business owners complain about unreliable subs, when the owners are not reliable themselves. To keep reliable subs, YOU have to be reliable also.
A good painting subcontractor is not going to work for you if:
-You don’t pay on-time.
-You don’t have steady work available.
-You don’t do what you say.
It goes both ways. You can complain about not finding reliable help, but if you’re not providing an appealing offer for subs, they’ll work for someone else.
Another complaint we hear about subs is that they’re too expensive. We hear ‘There’s no way you get away with paying your subs 50%’. But in fact, we DO get away with it.
We can pay our subs only 50% of a job and get away with it because:
-We pay on-time.
-We have steady work.
-We do what we say.
A good painting subcontractor can literally get a text containing an address and the colors and have the job completed 2 days later.
Can you imagine how much time you could save if you had subs like this?
We already told you how to KEEP them, but how do you FIND them?
Here’s how we find good subs:
Craigslist Ads – We find almost all of our subs from craigslist. We post ads and then sift through A LOT of applications. We only contact about 10-20% of them. After that we show them a job and what we can pay out. If they feel our price is in the ballpark, we meet at the job and get to know each other and agree on a price.
For new subs we’re considering, we show up at the beginning of each day to make sure the work is going well. If they do a good job, we give them another one, and another one, until we have a good, reliable sub on our hands.
How do we pay them?
We aim for 50% INCLUDING materials. So the subcontractor actually goes and buys paint/materials for us. This leaves us enough gross profit to invest in other things like:
-Marketing our business
-Production management
-Insurance
-Taxes
How do we keep subs from stealing our jobs?
We make sure to put our company lawn signs at the job. Then we monitor it. If any of our subs poach a job, or try to, we don’t work with them again.
After a couple jobs, they see we’re a great source of work. Most subs will not risk stealing a job after seeing this.
We’ve found that 5-7 good painting subcontractors can produce $1,000,000 in a season.
There could still be problems and you might need to get rid of some people. But overall this system will secure a good core of subcontractors for you, opening up all your time to grow your painting business.
Comment below for other suggestions on finding good subs. Thanks for reading!
45 Comments
I am considering starting a painting company. I am finding it difficult to get good help. Your. Article . is helpful. Thank you.
What should the ad say that I put on Craig list and what am I searching for when looking through applications?
Hi Robert, we recommend being straightforward with how much you pay, what type of projects you do etc. If you’re looking for subcontractors you’ll want to put something about having their own tools and transportation. We’ve also had success posting the actual job they’d be doing (a picture of the house). This way you can see how they perform on a real job.
Hi!
Thank you for all the great information you provide on your site.
I am starting my own painting company, I’m very new, I have only gotten one job so far and I did it myself. I want to get a sub, but I don’t have a steady flow of jobs yet. So, how do I handle this? Do I look for jobs first and then for subs to do the job or viceversa?
Thank you
Hi Freddy, we would recommend getting more jobs first so you can keep a new subcontractor busy. If you hire a sub before you have any work they won’t see you as a reliable source for new jobs.. Once you sell more bids, schedule them for a couple weeks out so you have time to find/hire a new sub for the work.
Thank you for your response, I appreciate it.
So, what happens if I can’t get a sub before the date I’m supposed to start the job? Are they easy to find? I apologize in advance for all the questions.
Also, do you guys offer coaching or classes?
Thank you!
Hi Freddy, I would allot whatever time you think you need to get a sub, so if you think it will take 2 weeks to interview/find a good sub, then schedule the paint job 2-3 weeks out. In our experience, there are a lot of good subcontractors needing work, so I wouldn’t say they are difficult to find. Worse case scenario, you don’t find one in time, then maybe you can reschedule the client.
We offer a sales coaching program every 6 months or so, but the most recent one just closed. We also have a whole course that offers this kind of advice here.
Thank you so much Chandler. One last question. What is the sales coaching program called?
Thank you!
You’re welcome, Freddy. It’s just called the “Sales Coaching Program” sponsored by Painting Business Pro. You can join the waiting list here.
I don’t understand this…
After that we show them a job and what we can pay out. If they feel our price is in the ballpark, we meet at the job and get to know each other and agree on a price.
You show them the job and them later meet at the same job?
Hi Chris, that’s correct. We talk to them before meeting to make sure our payout is at least in their ballpark. We send them pictures and sq. footage so they can get an idea of what they’ll be paid. Then we physically meet at the job to finalize a price.
As a contractor, how do you deal with a customer who gets angry about a job being done by subcontractors?
Hi Heather, that doesn’t happen to us very often. Subcontracting is basically just a tax shelter, so even though they are subs, we still consider them our crews and we only work with exceptional crews. So we rarely get any complaints about using subcontractors.
Two quick questions,
1. When you say 50% including materials, dose that mean they pay for the paint and other supplies out of the 50% of the total bid. or you pay them 50% plus material costs. ?
2. When you talk about sub contractors are you speaking of 1 person or more as the sub contractors ?
Hi Jim, to answer your questions:
1. 50% includes all materials: paint, other supplies etc.
2. A subcontractor is usually more than 1 painter. It’s usually a crew, which is 2-4 painters usually.
I’m I didn’t understand even though you explained in another comment they get 50% minus the material cost?
Thanks so much
We pay our subcontractors 50-60% of the sold job, which includes them purchasing materials (paint, caulk, tape etc.)
If we sold a paint job for $3,000. We would pay the sub $1,500-$1,800 to complete the job and purchase the materials.
Ok Now I’m confused. You say a subcontractor is 2-4 painters and I give 50% of the money from the job I sold. Do they divide that 50% between the 2-4 painters?
Hi Gabe, they can divide it however they want. I’m paying them 50% as a whole entity. I’m not worried about their payment structure, just if they do good work and are reliable.
I’m a painter over 30 years am looking good work as a subcontractor I carry my own insurance workers comp liability truck Tools in excetera
Dimitirios,
Where are you located?
who is required to carry workers comp insurance? The company or the sub?
Hi Anthony, you’d want to get insurance/workers comp for the company AND make sure your subs have it. It’s the smart thing to do and it’s not expensive considering the coverage you get. Also, customers want to know YOU have insurance, and you don’t want to have to explain that you don’t have insurance but your subs do for example.
As a subcontractor often what is the best way for me to pay for my help as for a (tax shelter) I would also like to know if you can recommend the best advice for a sub in the field. Greatly appreciate any response. Kind request, Derek
Cheers!!
I am a highly experience painter. Painting for many years. I always relied on other people for transportation. I never had drivers license. I am 72 years of age. At my age I still desire to start a business but I don’t know where to start without drivers license. Any advice.
Hi Jimmie, I’d recommend getting rides from your employees. You can pay them a little extra to get you too and from bids, job sites etc.
Did you say 72? What took you so long, Jimmie?
Hello,
So if your requiring the sub-contractor to purchase the paint, does he use my account and discounts that I receive from Sherwin Williams? Do I tell my subs what brand of paint to use? Like superpaint or promar 200?
I also read that your team requires the subcontractor to grab the check from the customer at the end of the job and delivers to the owner. Is this a good idea? Just seems like I would rather not have my subcontractors see the total estimate price. Unless of course, you are telling the subs you are only paying them half of the original estimate? Please explain this process in a little more detail.
Also I’m looking into getting liability insurance for my company and keep seeing ads pop up for Next Insurance for contractors. Are you familiar with them? Are they a good ?
Thanks so much for your time!
Hi Chris, good questions. Our whole model is based off trusting (but verifying) everything with our sub. We’ve worked with some of our subs for so many years that it doesn’t make sense for them to take advantage of us and lose all the work we have for them.
For example, if I was working with a NEW sub on the first job, I wouldn’t have them do some of these things; using my account, grabbing the check etc. But after a trusting relationship is established, you can literally delegate all these things to your sub.
And yes, we have the sub buy the paint. We include a price that includes their labor and materials cost. I also have not heard of next insurance. Hopefully this helps, thanks Chris
Hey Chandler,
We are a medium sized & quickly growing painting company looking to hire painting subcontractors in Illinois and Wisconsin.
Outside of craigslist ads, do you have any other methods that you’d recommend finding great quality painting subcontractors?
A couple other methods that work:
1. Referrals – Subs know other subs. You can ask them if they know any other good crews. Although understand that they may not be willing to give you names of the competition.
2. Indeed(dot)com is a good one. You can post an ad there and get some good applicants.
3. Paint store business cards: You’ll usually see a whole rack of business cards by different painters/painting companies in most paint stores. You can call through them and see if they are looking for any subcontracting work.
I have a question so if you say your paying your subs 50 percent you are really paying them 40 percent I know that materials are easily 10 percent of any job So in reality you are giving them 40 percent while you make 50 percent for really not lifting a finger don’t you think your taking advantage of your subs cause it sure sounds like it to me
Hi Brad, the 50% includes materials. So we are making 50% gross. Keep in mind we’re still paying for advertising/marketing to get the jobs and all the other expenses and overhead needed to maintain a steady flow of jobs for our subs. Our subs are completely aware the percentage they are being paid. It works for them because they don’t have to spend any money/time obtaining jobs, which can be the hardest and most expensive aspect of growing a painting business.
NO he isn’t taking advantage its HIS BUSINESS AND HIS NAME! He built this company, if the sub wants to make more than open his own business.
Hi, this is great information. Thank you for posting it. We have a small family business and have had it for just over 10 years. I have been painting since the 80’s. We get plenty of leads. Referrals and sometimes I pay for leads. It is time to grow. This sounds like a good idea. I do have a few questions. So, I score the job. Offer my new sub 50% of the job. They need to carry liability insurance (like I have) . 1099 them… I guess however I work the deal I can pay for the paint or have them pay for it.. I think that it may be more appealing to my new potential sub if I did. Now I am just trying to figure out the verbiage to a help wanted ad…amongst the 8,000 other things that I do running this small business.
Hi Sean, we’ve found that the best performing ads are the most direct. Explain clearly what the job is and what the offer is. We’ve also created ads that show a house and how to price it, to make sure they’re in the 50%-60% range.
Hello,
Great article. My fiance has owned his own painting company for a few years now and is doing amazing. He is smart, resourceful and has lots of connections with contractors around town and surrounding towns. Lately, he has been wanting to take his business to the next level. He has a crew of 6-10 (varies on the time of year), but he has a hard time finding new people. Do you have any suggestions for finding new employees?
His current employees (2-3) tend to take their job for granted and although have done good work, aren’t worth keeping due to call outs, negative attitudes and at times not doing good at their job.
Hi ,
Does it common to let the sub to sign prior the job on a confidentiality agreement, including an agreement that says he would not be able to steal customers. If he does, I can sue him. ?
My name is wanda lampley.I moved from Laurel MS to knoxville Tn.I am an awesome painter and have been for fifteen years. I am a neat and clean painter and I take pride in my work I love painting dry wall. I am not afraid of heights,and I have my own transportation and I have my GED.thank you, I’m looking forward to hearing from you.
Hi, I am glad I found your YouTube videos. I’m a young guy who became licensed 4 years ago and built up my company as a one man crew. I have hired employees over the years but it hasn’t worked out. Either they have no experience and by the time I train them up to were they aren’t costing me money they decide the work is too tough and leave. Or if I hire experienced painters they are late, unreliable, will miss a day which in turn messes up the schedule for the next start date. I have never paid for advertising I have believe that if I provide the best survive and product they will recommend my company to their friends and family. So far it has worked out great and I am becoming overwhelmed with the amount of jobs I am getting so I’d like to give an outside crew a shot. The only thing that bothers me is that it’s my good name I have been building up over the last 4 years, making sure every single customer is 110% satisfied. I’m afraid that either the customer would be expecting me to be performing the work or worse if the subs do a sub par job it could ruin the reputation I’ve built for my company. What do you think?
Another question, are the subs you hire licensed or do you have them work under your license? I recently met a couple guys that were interested in taking jobs from me and splitting the profit as long as they are protected under my license. In a case like that were they aren’t licensed, would I have to hire them as employees and put them on payroll, get worker’s compensation, etc. in order for them to work under my license?
When I first started my business at 27 yrs old I was excited to get out there and start working but I think it’s time to sit down and reorganize the company as well as create a solid business plan now that I know what to expect as far as income, overhead, influx of leads. Where is a good place to start with that? I’m currently a sole proprietor, bonded and insured but I don’t have worker’s compensation and I dread the idea of paying by the hour, I’d rather split profits from a job.
And one laaaast question, I’m curious to learn more about using my license to help others start their own business, I could be the qualifying individual and hold 33% equity in a company someone else runs, sounds nice to me. Have you ever attempted something like that? Can you think of any Pro’s and Cons?
I apologize, I kept thinking of new questions the more I started writing. Again thank you for helping inspire me to grow my business, I’m confident this will be the year I search for a talented independent crew to bring aboard.
1. Hi Tom, as you add people, you certainly add risk of getting bad reviews..but it’s the only way to grow. Just be very picky with who you hire. Even jobs that don’t go perfectly can be salvaged.
2. We make sure the subs are licensed and insured, and then we have our own insurance just in case.
3. You can get our sister-company’s course: paintingbusinesspro.com which will help you with all that
4. We do a similar type partnership with new painting companies we open in different states, so that’s definitely one way to do it.
Hopefully this helps, thanks Tom
What exactly do you have in your Craigslist add that works so well? I have been struggling to find help sence the day I started my business over a year ago. Thanks.
I’ve been doing this since I was18 and I believe that it’s the hussle the get out there and hussle of the individual that wants it .In these times it’s not what it use to be not at all so be sure it’s what you want . Can I get some prices to get started Im into the reality and sinceraty of what your saying .
Despite having many years under our belt of remodeling, painting, fixing, etc residential properties, we realized that working separately is not sustainable, therefore, decided to combine man power and open a new firm servicing ~60 miles of Cincinnati, OH. To earn “business credits” and trust we would like to work as painting subcontractors to have a steady work flow. We have a team of 3 insured, reliable, efficient, competent and dependable painters who are available for work immediately. Thank you for reading!
Chandler, if we decide to join your network of painters to bid on jobs, do you have anything in Cincinnati, OH and 60miles around it? What are the requirements to join?
Thank you and stay safe!
Great information, I have a question on how you handle the subs getting the materials.
Do you give the subs a deposit?
Do they pay out of their pocket?
Do you have a account set up under your company name for them to buy under and get discount?
Is the point of this to keep the purchase of materials off your books?